Complete Beginner Advice - Follow Up

[benm]

Hi all,

I am posting this as a new thread as I have a lot of questions , but it is a follow up to this one.

I'm going to go for 2x DS-2CD2386G2 Cameras, potentially getting another one later. I might get a Hikvision doorbell too.

1. I have read in another post that now the ColorVu cameras can only turn the white light on when an alarm is triggered. If that is right, don't know if that makes sense as it surely needs the light to see events. But based on my scenario above where I can't have the light constantly on and don't have much ambient light, am I still best to go with the DS-2CD2386G2?

2. What is the best lens type to go for? 2.8mm or 4mm I think are my choices, but not sure how to work out what's best. I just need normal driveway and back garden cameras

3. I would like to go with your recommendation of DS-7608NI-I28P. This has enough channels and is PoE. But If I have a camera plugged into a switch/hub then onto the NVR would this also need to be a PoE switch?

4. What do these seemingly conflicting statements mean from their site on this NVR model? Does this mean I can only use this functionality on one camera? Or maybe one camera at a time but only 2MP cameras? Is this limiting for me??

"Up to 1-ch facial recognition for video stream"
"Up to 4-ch 2 MP (H.264/H.265) video analysis for human and vehicle recognition to reduce false alarm"

5. As this has only 2x HDD slots, is RAID not an option? Would you recommend using some sort of backup device alongside this, or maybe in the cloud?

6. I think 2x 6TB would be more than enough. But I read on WD site that "8TB, 10TB, 12TB, 14TB & 18TB drives are designed to support Deep Learning analytics in AI capable NVRs" - So would I need a minimum of 8TB to allow smart events, etc. in the Hikvision NVR? I understand I can't use H.265+ with this.

7. Are all the Accusense features covered by this NVR - I read on your product page that for false alarms I would need an 'AcuSense/DeepinMind NVR' - is this one or can you please provide a link to one (if its worth the price?)?

8. One of the turret cameras will go on a side wall. Can i mount it directly on the side wall and physically turn the camera or flip the image in the app to correct it? Or do I really need to purchase a bracket? Brackets do make the cameras really stand out, so I would like to avoid if possible. But if do need one, which model do I need to get please?

9. Does anyone have experience with the Hikvision doorbell e.g. this one? I understand it is PoE hardwired only now. I don't intend to use any door control at home but would like to integrate with the cameras instead of something else like Ring

Thanks very much in advance!

 

[Dan]

Hi @benm

Answers below

1) The ColorVu camera's white light can be set to either always on (when it's dark enough to be needed) or on when event triggers. If you have minimal ambient lighting in the scene (e.g. no street lights or security lights) then a camera model with IR LEDs for low-light recording will probably deliver clearer night images.

2) Focal length choice is dependant on the size of area you need the camera to cover, 2.8mm gives you the widest field of view to cover the largest area but covering a larger area stretches the pixels that make up the image and thus reduces the distance at which you can clearly identify detail. As you narrow the focal length to 4mm and beyond you narrow the FoV covering a smaller area but also gain more detail over longer distances. The specific FoV coverage of each camera is stated on their datasheets and if you want to get an idea of what will work in your space you can use this camera calculator

3) Yes, if a camera is connected to a switch elsewhere on your local network then that switch needs to be PoE to provide power to the camera. You can technically connect a secondary PoE switch to the ports on the NVR but this does require some adjustments to the NVR settings, usually, if people are connecting an external PoE switch they just have that connected directly to their router or another local network access point. (e.g. a network wall port or standard switch already connected to the router)

4) Do you have a link to where you have seen this information? We can't see this information on the 7608NI-I2/8P product page at Hikvision's website.

5) HDD failure is very rare and the chances of it happening at the same time as an event happening where you needed to extract footage is even rarer, so we would so there is no need for any kind of storage back up.

6) Any HDD size will support the Hikvision smart functions, you can double-check the capacity you will need to meet your requirements by using the Western Digital Capacity Calculator

7) You can see all the AcuSense functionality that is supported by the I-series NVRs in this YouTube video, DeepinMind NVRs are very expensive (£1,000+) and do not offer much benefit over I-series unless you are using DeepinView cameras. (which start at around £500-600 per camera)

8) The turret cameras have 3-axis of adjustment (Pan: 0° to 360°, tilt: 0° to 75°, rotate: 0° to 360°) so you can pan/tilt/rotate the camera into almost any position, as well as rotate the image within the camera settings if you wish. If you want to angle the camera to look along the wall it is mounted to then we would recommend a wall bracket because the tilt angle does not go all the way to 90 degrees perpendicular with the wall, the wall bracket will push the camera out from the wall and allow you to achieve the rotation needed to look along the wall. The compatible wall bracket for the 2386G2 is the DS-1273ZJ-140

9) Yes, the vandal-resistant doorbell is a hardwired PoE model. As it is hard wired it has its own IP address and can be added to your NVR to record the doorbells live stream as well as connected to the Hik-Connect app for the intercom/doorbell function. (the doorbell cannot be directly connected to the Poe ports on the NVR because it has to be visible to the mobile app as its own device for the doorbell function to work)

 

[benm]

Hi @benm

Answers below

1) The ColorVu camera's white light can be set to either always on (when it's dark enough to be needed) or on when event triggers. If you have minimal ambient lighting in the scene (e.g. no street lights or security lights) then a camera model with IR LEDs for low-light recording will probably deliver clearer night images.

2) Focal length choice is dependant on the size of area you need the camera to cover, 2.8mm gives you the widest field of view to cover the largest area but covering a larger area stretches the pixels that make up the image and thus reduces the distance at which you can clearly identify detail. As you narrow the focal length to 4mm and beyond you narrow the FoV covering a smaller area but also gain more detail over longer distances. The specific FoV coverage of each camera is stated on their datasheets and if you want to get an idea of what will work in your space you can use this camera calculator

3) Yes, if a camera is connected to a switch elsewhere on your local network then that switch needs to be PoE to provide power to the camera. You can technically connect a secondary PoE switch to the ports on the NVR but this does require some adjustments to the NVR settings, usually, if people are connecting an external PoE switch they just have that connected directly to their router or another local network access point. (e.g. a network wall port or standard switch already connected to the router)

4) Do you have a link to where you have seen this information? We can't see this information on the 7608NI-I2/8P product page at Hikvision's website.

5) HDD failure is very rare and the chances of it happening at the same time as an event happening where you needed to extract footage is even rarer, so we would so there is no need for any kind of storage back up.

6) Any HDD size will support the Hikvision smart functions, you can double-check the capacity you will need to meet your requirements by using the Western Digital Capacity Calculator

7) You can see all the AcuSense functionality that is supported by the I-series NVRs in this YouTube video, DeepinMind NVRs are very expensive (£1,000+) and do not offer much benefit over I-series unless you are using DeepinView cameras. (which start at around £500-600 per camera)

8) The turret cameras have 3-axis of adjustment (Pan: 0° to 360°, tilt: 0° to 75°, rotate: 0° to 360°) so you can pan/tilt/rotate the camera into almost any position, as well as rotate the image within the camera settings if you wish. If you want to angle the camera to look along the wall it is mounted to then we would recommend a wall bracket because the tilt angle does not go all the way to 90 degrees perpendicular with the wall, the wall bracket will push the camera out from the wall and allow you to achieve the rotation needed to look along the wall. The compatible wall bracket for the 2386G2 is the DS-1273ZJ-140

9) Yes, the vandal-resistant doorbell is a hardwired PoE model. As it is hard wired it has its own IP address and can be added to your NVR to record the doorbells live stream as well as connected to the Hik-Connect app for the intercom/doorbell function. (the doorbell cannot be directly connected to the Poe ports on the NVR because it has to be visible to the mobile app as its own device for the doorbell function to work)

Hi

Thanks so much for your replies, really helpful!

Q2. I will look at the calculator, but is there a most commonly bought lens type for household-type use?

Q4. This is what I've seen on the site.

Q9. Ok so the Doorbell cannot connect directly to the NVR ports, so I will need to get PoE switches to get it from the porch to the NVR?
Do you have experience with it in use in general? Is it any good??

Cheers!

 

[Dan]

Q2 - focal length that is most popular is 2.8mm BUT this does not mean it is suitable for every scenario. If the areas you want to cover around your property are all no greater than 10-15m from the camera's position then 2.8mm should be fine, but if you have longer/larger areas to cover (like a 20-30m garden) then you may be better off with a narrower 4/6mm focal camera.

Q4 - This is not the specs for the DS-7608NI-I2/8P that we had previously recommended to you, this is the AcuSense NVR model which is not currently available in the UK. (it is easy to get confused because the model number is almost exactly the same except for the NXI part in the middle and the /S at the end)

Q9 - we do not have lots of hands-on experience with this doorbell model but we have sold several of them and had very few complaints about their performance. To be clear the PoE injector/switch that the doorbell is connected to has to be connected somewhere else on your local network (e.g. direct to the router, a wall network port, a standard network switch already connected to the router) and NOT to the PoE ports on the NVR because this still means the doorbell will be using the NVRs subnet IP address range (192.168.254.xxx) which is not visible to devices outside the NVR's subnet range like the Hik-Connect app.

 

[benm]

ah ok thanks. yes it's confusing.
these are the links to the one you recommend?

Hikvision DS-7608NI-I2-8P 8 Channel Network Video Recorder

Key Features: - 8 Channel NVR - 8 POE Ports - H.265+H.265/H.264/H.264+/MPEG4 video formats - Up to 8 IP cameras can be connected - Supports live view, storage and playback of the connected camera at up to 12MP resolution - HDMI and VGA outputs provided - Up to 2 SATA interfaces connectable for...

www.use-ip.co.uk

DS-7608NI-I2/8P

Hikvision DS-7608NI-I2/8P 8-ch 1U 8 PoE 4K NVR

www.hikvision.com

 

[Dan]

Yes, that is the I-series DS-7608NI-I2/8P 8-channel NVR which is what we would recommend for the cameras you want to use.

 

[benm]

Ok thanks. one last one. When i pick the mm focal length, do i purchase a camera model variant with that lens e.g. from on the site

Hikvision DS-2CD2386G2-IU 8MP AcuSense Turret Network Camera With Built-In Microphone

Key Features: - 8 Megapixel Resolution - Powered by Darkfighter - Built-in Microphone - IP66 Rated - 120dB WDR (Wide Dynamic Range) - 3840 x 2160 @ 20 fps - H.265+, H.265, H.624+, H.264 - On Board Storage - IR Range Up To 30m Hikvision Network Camera User ManualHikvision DS-2CD2386G2-IU...

www.use-ip.co.uk

or does everyone buy the same model and then can set the focal length once you get it?

 

[Dan]

Yes, you need to select the focal length you want from the dropdown on the product page because the cameras focal length is fixed, focal length/FoV cannot be changed/adjusted during or after installing the camera.

 

[benm]

I thought it would be easier to show what I am considering. The camera will go here on this wall and be monitoring a driveway below it. One car space will be where the skip is, and one where the toilet/small tree is. I'm thinking a 2.8 is perfect for this.

However, I would ideally also like to monitor my garage in a block which is directly opposite the camera position but some way away - I'm struggling to decide now whether 2.8 mm won't see as far as the garage, but 4mm might not cover both car spaces. What do you think?

Also, the NVR can definitely take more than the 'up to 8TB' disks stated on their website e.g. 2x 10TB?

Cheers!

 

[Dan]

I think in that location the 4mm focal length will be fine, with the 2386G2 the 4mm focal length will give you 87.1° FoV which is just under 90 degrees so with the camera positioned in that right-angle corner you should get full coverage without going as far as the 2.8mm which is wider than 90 degrees and will waist some of your FoV on the walls either side of the camera.

 

[benm]

Great - thanks a lot for all your help Dan
The NVR can take 2x 10TB disks can't they?

 

[benm]

sorry - I'm assuming that you are referring to the angle when on a bracket, not mounted directly on the side wall? Or does it not matter?

 

[Dan]

Now you have shown the camera position and the area you would like to cover I think it would be ok to mount the camera directly to the wall (or use a junction box) because you are not tilting the camera to the extreme right or left, you are looking roughly straight down the middle between the 2 cars.